Communities

Writing
Writing
Codidact Meta
Codidact Meta
The Great Outdoors
The Great Outdoors
Photography & Video
Photography & Video
Scientific Speculation
Scientific Speculation
Cooking
Cooking
Electrical Engineering
Electrical Engineering
Judaism
Judaism
Languages & Linguistics
Languages & Linguistics
Software Development
Software Development
Mathematics
Mathematics
Christianity
Christianity
Code Golf
Code Golf
Music
Music
Physics
Physics
Linux Systems
Linux Systems
Power Users
Power Users
Tabletop RPGs
Tabletop RPGs
Community Proposals
Community Proposals
tag:snake search within a tag
answers:0 unanswered questions
user:xxxx search by author id
score:0.5 posts with 0.5+ score
"snake oil" exact phrase
votes:4 posts with 4+ votes
created:<1w created < 1 week ago
post_type:xxxx type of post
Search help
Notifications
Mark all as read See all your notifications »
Q&A

Post History

60%
+1 −0
Q&A If assūmptiō = 'take up', then can ad- (prefix) = 'up'? But why, when super- = 'up'?

Indo-European spatial prepositions, when analyzed across all attested languages, are rich in beautiful, unexpected relationships[1]. You could think that the spatial relationships (above, below, b...

posted 2y ago by Jirka Hanika‭  ·  edited 2y ago by Jirka Hanika‭

Answer
#2: Post edited by user avatar Jirka Hanika‭ · 2022-08-06T20:11:35Z (over 2 years ago)
typo correction
  • Indo-European spatial prepositions, when analyzed across all attested languages, are rich in beautiful, unexpected relationships[^1].
  • You could think that the spatial relationships (above, below, beside, etc.) are independent of the language studied, but that is not so. Like everything in language, the world is first [articulated](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_articulation), in a language specific way, into concepts (e.g., spatial relationships worth naming) and then each concept is articulated again into a sequence of meaningless sounds that form the word to stand for that concept (e.g., a spatial preposition).
  • When you try to translate those prepositions into another language, you often end up with lots of synonymy and homonymy, but that is largely only apparent - because the *concepts* do not match. What appears to be blatant synonymy on one side of a translation may involve very little semantic overlap in the other language. The confusing effect is caused by assuming certain arbitrary context during the translation and then contradicting that by assuming that the translation covers the entire lexical unit in all possible contexts. With grammatical words such as prepositions, translation word-for-word doesn't tend to work. They are very much language dependent and context dependent, even more than nouns or verbs.
  • Latin "ad" can be a translation, in certain contexts, of any of English "at", "on", "toward, "among", "against" (plus of various temporal and other relationships as well). This is entirely unsurprising. There is not a 1-1 mapping between spatial concepts in English and spatial concepts in Latin.
  • I did not list "above" nor "up"[^2], though. If you focus on "assumption" = "taking up", this occurrence of "up" is not a spatial one at all. As such it does not approach the possible spatial meanings of "super" ("above", "over", "beyond") at all.
  • So while apparent synonymy between spatial prepositions, especially if freely moving back and forth between two languages is extremely common to find, this question is not an example of one.
  • [^1]: Latin "sub" and "super" are supposed to have originated from the same root in Proto-Indo-European. Topsy-turvy, isn't it?
  • [^2]: "up" = "toward the above" in one of its spatial meanings. It can also mean "along", and then there are non-spatial meanings.
  • Indo-European spatial prepositions, when analyzed across all attested languages, are rich in beautiful, unexpected relationships[^1].
  • You could think that the spatial relationships (above, below, beside, etc.) are independent of the language studied, but that is not so. Like everything in language, the world is first [articulated](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_articulation), in a language specific way, into concepts (e.g., spatial relationships worth naming) and then each concept is articulated again into a sequence of meaningless sounds that form the word to stand for that concept (e.g., a spatial preposition).
  • When you try to translate those prepositions into another language, you often end up with lots of synonymy and homonymy, but that is largely only apparent - because the *concepts* do not match. What appears to be blatant synonymy on one side of a translation may involve very little semantic overlap in the other language. The confusing effect is caused by assuming certain arbitrary context during the translation and then contradicting that by assuming that the translation covers the entire lexical unit in all possible contexts. With grammatical words such as prepositions, translation word-for-word doesn't tend to work. They are very much language dependent and context dependent, even more than nouns or verbs.
  • Latin "ad" can be a translation, in certain contexts, of any of English "at", "on", "toward, "among", "against" (plus of various temporal and other relationships as well). This is entirely unsurprising. There is not a 1-1 mapping between spatial concepts in English and spatial concepts in Latin.
  • I did not list "above" nor "up"[^2], though. If you focus on "assumptio" = "taking up", this occurrence of "up" is not a spatial one at all. As such it does not approach the possible spatial meanings of "super" ("above", "over", "beyond") at all.
  • So while apparent synonymy between spatial prepositions, especially if freely moving back and forth between two languages is extremely common to find, this question is not an example of one.
  • [^1]: Latin "sub" and "super" are supposed to have originated from the same root in Proto-Indo-European. Topsy-turvy, isn't it?
  • [^2]: "up" = "toward the above" in one of its spatial meanings. It can also mean "along", and then there are non-spatial meanings.
#1: Initial revision by user avatar Jirka Hanika‭ · 2022-08-05T14:48:09Z (over 2 years ago)
Indo-European spatial prepositions, when analyzed across all attested languages, are rich in beautiful, unexpected relationships[^1].

You could think that the spatial relationships (above, below, beside, etc.) are independent of the language studied, but that is not so.  Like everything in language, the world is first [articulated](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_articulation), in a language specific way, into concepts (e.g., spatial relationships worth naming) and then each concept is articulated again into a sequence of meaningless sounds that form the word to stand for that concept (e.g., a spatial preposition).

When you try to translate those prepositions into another language, you often end up with lots of synonymy and homonymy, but that is largely only apparent - because the *concepts* do not match.  What appears to be blatant synonymy on one side of a translation may involve very little semantic overlap in the other language.  The confusing effect is caused by assuming certain arbitrary context during the translation and then contradicting that by assuming that the translation covers the entire lexical unit in all possible contexts.  With grammatical words such as prepositions, translation word-for-word doesn't tend to work.  They are very much language dependent and context dependent, even more than nouns or verbs.

Latin "ad" can be a translation, in certain contexts, of any of English "at", "on", "toward, "among", "against" (plus of various temporal and other relationships as well).  This is entirely unsurprising.  There is not a 1-1 mapping between spatial concepts in English and spatial concepts in Latin.

I did not list "above" nor "up"[^2], though.  If you focus on "assumption" = "taking up", this occurrence of "up" is not a spatial one at all.  As such it does not approach the possible spatial meanings of "super" ("above", "over", "beyond") at all.

So while apparent synonymy between spatial prepositions, especially if freely moving back and forth between two languages is extremely common to find, this question is not an example of one.

[^1]: Latin "sub" and "super" are supposed to have originated from the same root in Proto-Indo-European.  Topsy-turvy, isn't it?

[^2]: "up" = "toward the above" in one of its spatial meanings.  It can also mean "along", and then there are non-spatial meanings.