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Comments on Etymology of "son of a gun"

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Etymology of "son of a gun"

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What's the origin of the expression "son of a gun"?

This comic explains a possible origin: British Navy used to allow women on naval ships, and any child born on board who had uncertain paternity would be called "son of a gun" (because "gun" would be a slang for "a military guy"). This is supported by other sources, such as this and this.

But Wiktionary says that "Folk etymologies suggesting nautical origins are not supported by evidence".

Considering those contraditory sources, which one is correct?

Is the kid-born-on-a-ship history true? In case it's not, what would be the origin of this expression?

According to Merriam-Webster, Cambridge and Collins dictionaries, "son of a gun" is an euphemism for "son of a b*tch", but I'm not interested in how the expression became an euphemism, only in its origin, regardless of the meaning it has today.

etymology
posted almost 4 years ago
4y ago
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hkotsubo‭
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msh210‭ wrote almost 4 years ago
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"The expression "son of a gun' is an euphemism for 'son of a b*tch'." I highly doubt this. I strongly suspect the two developed independently. I have no support for saying so, though, but, then, neither do you provide any support for your claim to the contrary.

msh210‭ wrote almost 4 years ago
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FWIW see https://www.etymonline.com/word/son

Moshi‭ wrote almost 4 years ago
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@msh210 support for "The expression "son of a gun' is an euphemism for 'son of a b*tch'": Merriam-Webster (https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/son%20of%20a%20gun) Cambridge dictionary (https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dictionary/english/son-of-a-gun) Collins dictionary (https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/son-of-a-gun, see AME section)

msh210‭ wrote almost 4 years ago · edited almost 4 years ago
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Well, then, @Moshi , there's the origin. Someone took "son of a bitch" and substituted a word he didn't like. What's the question, then?

hkotsubo‭ wrote almost 4 years ago
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@Moshi Thanks for the links, I've added them to the question.

hkotsubo‭ wrote almost 4 years ago
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@msh210 I just wanted to provide some context about the expression's meaning. But if it's not relevant to the question (which is "what's its origin?"), I can remove the first paragraph.

msh210‭ wrote almost 4 years ago
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Not sure what you're asking, really. If it's known to be a euphemism, isn't that its etymology? Or do you mean as follows? "Son of a gun has an older sense, which I'm seeking the etymology of. Later, it was also used as a euphemism…."

hkotsubo‭ wrote almost 4 years ago
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@msh210 I've edited the question again, hope it's clear now.